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OpenVMS Hobbyist Program | VAX Systems Forums | Emulated VAX Forum
Author Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Daniel Marin
Member

Posts: 5
Joined: 14.10.13
Posted on October 14 2013 07:07
Greetings,

First of all, I'm a beginner with VAX, OpenVMS and SimH, please keep this in mind.

I have a SIMH VM running with OpenVMS OS fully installed and with Hobbyist licenses already activated. Now, what I've been trying to do is to read the contend of a CD I have, which has a application specifically for VAX-OpenVMS. Of course, I created an ISO 9660 image with this CD, however, an error appears when I try to mount it on OpenVMS. The following are the command I use to mount the unit, and the message displayed (supposed I mount my ISO image on DUA1):

$ mount dua1
_Label: disk03
_Log name: disk03
%%%%%%%% OPCOM 14-OCT-2013 10:34:11.25 %%%%%%%%%
Message from user SYSTEM on DELTAV
incorrect volume label

%Mount-I-OPRQST, incorrect volume label

...And the system request me to mount volume DISK03 in device DUA1. The following are the command I've been using on SIMH:

sim> set rq1 rrd40
sim> attach -r rq1 disk03.iso

I don't know where could be the problem, but I think this problem is because I don't know the volume label of the CD I have, and this label I should type it when I mount the unit. Could be this the problem? If the problem is this, or another (like bad ISO image, bad configuration, etc.), What I should do to fix it?

I'll appreciate any help given.

Regards,

Daniel Marin.
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
somersdave
Member

Posts: 67
Location: bristol,UK
Joined: 23.03.07
Posted on October 14 2013 10:52
Not been doing much VMS-wise lately (hope to rectify now the Summer has gone) but hope this helps:

you could try MOUNT/OVERRIDE = IDENT (from memory).

The HELP facility is pretty good with VMS unlike some other systems (eg: man for UNIX)

Here's a page of relevant manual:

http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/84final/9996/9996pro_147.html

Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Daniel Marin
Member

Posts: 5
Joined: 14.10.13
Posted on October 17 2013 12:09
Somersdave,

That definitely worked! Unfortunately, the problem seems to be another, because even if I look at the CD content, I need to boot from this CD, but an error appears each time I boot from it. I think I will post it on another thread.

Anyway, thank you for your help.
Regards.
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Bruce Claremont
Member

Posts: 606
Joined: 07.01.10
Posted on October 18 2013 03:29
If you can mount the CD and view the contents, then you should be able to boot from it. What command are you using to boot and what is the error?
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Daniel Marin
Member

Posts: 5
Joined: 14.10.13
Posted on October 18 2013 04:28
Ok, checking once again, I tried mounting the CD and checking the contained files using the following commands (assuming DUA2 is the CD port):

$ MOUNT/OVERRIDE = IDENT DUA2
...
$ set def dua2:
$ dir
$! but the message that appears is the following:
%DIRECT-E-OPENIN, error opening DUA2:[SYSMGR]X.X;X as input
-RMS-E-DNF, directory not found
-SYSTEM-W-NOSUCHFILE, no such file

When I try to boot from CD, I use the commands "boot dua2", or "B/10000000 DKA200" , but the following message appears:

>>>b dua2
(BOOT/R5:0 DUA2


2..
-DUA2
1..0..


?50 SCB2NDINT, DUA2
?06 HLT INST
PC = 00000C1A

What could be? I checked the installation manual of this CD and says that this CD is designed for working on computers with NVAX CPU. Is there a significant difference between boot from NVAX and boot from CVAX? (which is the CPU of the MicroVAX 3900, the same from the SIMH simulator).

Thanks in advance.

Regards.
Edited by Daniel Marin on October 18 2013 04:35
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
somersdave
Member

Posts: 67
Location: bristol,UK
Joined: 23.03.07
Posted on October 18 2013 07:11
I'm not familiar with emulators and also a bit 'rusty' but some points:

using SHOW DEVICE DUA2 /FULL - should let you know some information about the disk like whether it has successfully mounted. When the disk was mounted I think you should have got a success message.

the command DIR DUA2:[000000] should tell you what is in the top level directory and
DIR DUA2:[000000...] should list everything on the disk.

I recall using the MOUNT/FOREIGN command when doing tape backups - I think the FOREIGN qualifier is used if you are not sure of the file structure but I can't try anything as my machines aren't booted at the moment (I don't fire the alphas up unless I'm going to devote some time!)
Edited by somersdave on October 18 2013 07:14
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Daniel Marin
Member

Posts: 5
Joined: 14.10.13
Posted on October 18 2013 11:19
Somersdave, I used your commands and they worked, I could see the CD content and some properties, however, I don't know if it's possible to run the installer/app without a boot from CD, just directly from OpenVMS and running an specific file. What could it be the cause it won't boot?
Is there a possibility to boot from a specific address?

I hope this information could be useful. If you need more information about the CD content, just let me know.
Edited by Daniel Marin on October 18 2013 11:21
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
somersdave
Member

Posts: 67
Location: bristol,UK
Joined: 23.03.07
Posted on October 18 2013 12:09
From memory when I received the Hobbyist OpenVMS 8.3 CD from the US I booted the Alpha from the CD/installed 8.3 and once the system was installed I was then able to boot normally, log in, mount the CD, see the files on it and copy them onto the Alphas system disk. They were .ZIP files which I unzipped and product installed or VMS installed (seem to remember two options - bit hazy!) (so the CD 'doubled' as a boot device and software 'store'smiley

It seems that you are trying to do something similar with the emulated version (about which I'm lacking knowledge)

I found this series of SIMH related videos from another hobbyist user which might be of interest

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftJ-7dDabAY
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Bruce Claremont
Member

Posts: 606
Joined: 07.01.10
Posted on October 21 2013 14:10
Ah, the light bulb goes on. If memory serves, VAX VMS was never bootable from the CD. Only Alpha and Integrity CDs are bootable.

Since you can mount and access the CD contents, you can use @SYS$UPDATE:VMSINSTAL.COM to install the VMS kits on the CD.
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
malmberg
Moderator

Posts: 528
Joined: 15.04.08
Posted on October 22 2013 03:55
VAX/VMS installation CD-ROMs are bootable.

None of the VMS installation media are ISO media, they are disk images, with a sysgen parameter set to indicate that they are read-only.

Any software that requires or treats VMS installation media as ISO format volumes instead of disk images will fail.

Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Daniel Marin
Member

Posts: 5
Joined: 14.10.13
Posted on October 22 2013 07:25
Thank you all for your comments.

However, I'm finding difficult to boot the CD, at least from the SIMH simulator since the software was designed for another VAX model.

I'm going to explain more in deep what I need, as a last hope.

The software I've been trying to install was designed for an specific model of VAX, unfortunately I've been unable to find vendors on internet, mostly because is an outdated model for industrial use. The following link shows a datasheet for this model:

http://www.emersonprocess.com/systems/support/documentation/provox/docvue/Product%20Data%20Sheets/Consoles%20-%20OWP/buDC9500.pdf

On page 4 details specs for this model. It seems that the VAX model that is very similar to this one is the VAXstation 4000/90 series, however, I need to be sure that with this model will work, that's why I've been using simulators. Unfortunately I haven't found VAXstation 4000/90 freeware or demo simulators in order to be sure.

I also tried ALPHA simulators, with no results.

It seems that the VAX model I should use must have SCSI fixed disks and an NVAX processor, I'm guessing it from what I saw on the SW user manual, here's the link:

http://www.emersonprocess.com/systems/support/documentation/provox/docvue/Consoles/OWP/pnDC9440p22.pdf

On chapter 4 details the installation procedure, that's the procedure I've been following.

I hope this information could be useful. I'm looking for any reasonable solution (software or hardware) in order to run this app. I will be waiting for your answers.

Regards.
Edited by Daniel Marin on October 22 2013 07:27
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
somersdave
Member

Posts: 67
Location: bristol,UK
Joined: 23.03.07
Posted on October 22 2013 09:24
Here are the links - (I perceive that this is not your usual kind of home entertainment system)


http://www.emersonprocess.com/systems/support/documentation/provox/docvue/Product%20Data%20Sheets/Consoles%20-%20OWP/buDC9500.pdf



http://www.emersonprocess.com/systems/support/documentation/provox/docvue/Consoles/OWP/pnDC9440p22.pdf

If you can mount the disk and read the software on it why not create some directories on your emulated VAX session and copy some files across and say try running the .EXE files with the RUN command - just for fun and see what happens.

NB - IT MIGHT BE A GOOD IDEA TO RUN THE SOFTWARE FROM A "LOW PRIVILEGE" ACCOUNT - IF YOU DO START TRYING THINGS, that way (though I'm no systems management expert) I think there should be less chance of the software corrupting any parts of the VMS system (others more knowledgeable might have a view on this possibility)

PS:To be a bit more serious: If you're doing something of a commercial nature which might involve real risks, it would probably a good idea to contact the company which supplied the original software. They might give some advice, let you have some more recent software on a trial basis, etc - especially if you have some legitimate but more obsolete software.
Edited by somersdave on October 22 2013 21:25
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
malmberg
Moderator

Posts: 528
Joined: 15.04.08
Posted on October 23 2013 03:09
Unless the software is doing low-level SCSI access, or some type of "license check" it should not care what VMS hardware it is running on.

Most software that will run on one model of VAX will run on all models of VAXen, even software that claims that it will not. Usually it is a case that the vendor is only claiming support for the specific platforms that they tested.

If they made the mistake of hard coding VMS device names, you should be able to backup/image CD-ROM to a simulated hard disk and modify the SYLOGICALS.COM file to map the DKAnnn names to DUAn: with DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXEC/TRANS=CONC DKA300 DUA0:

SimH is emulating a VAX 3900 model with memory and disks (and possibly CPU) that far exceed the capability of the VAXstation 4000/90.

I would be surprised if the logical name hack did not work. Usually depending on physical device names on VMS is a novice programming / system management bug.

But this sounds like a commercial application, not a hobbyist application.

If this is a hobby application, I am really curious about what it is doing.
Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
malmberg
Moderator

Posts: 528
Joined: 15.04.08
Posted on October 23 2013 03:19
Looking down the manual, it is clear that the person that wrote it was not an experienced VMS system manager.

1. Only the system management uses physical device names, not users or end-programs. The system manager sets up mapping of the physical names to logical names which are used by everything else. The system manager should be able to change the mapping at any time with no notice to the users or changes to the application program.

2. DECNET proxies should be used instead of putting usernames and passwords in the file specifications.

http://sourceforge.net/p/vms-ports/wiki/VMSSystemManagement/

Author RE: Mounting ISO images on SIMH
Bruce Claremont
Member

Posts: 606
Joined: 07.01.10
Posted on October 23 2013 05:24
Caution: PROVOX is a special case. Software is tweaked and they used proprietary I/O cards in some systems, particularly the Q-BUS VAX systems.
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